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Ron Stygar Carl Buckland Dale Beuning Forums Help
From digest.v4.n806 Thu Jul 4 11:31:22 1996 From: djchin_at_dsrna.agi.org (daniel j. chin) Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 11:12:35 -0700 Subject: re: <96> <E36 M3> performance mods This is a slightly modified response to Jim Conforti's response to my previous blurb about 96 M3 performance mods (i replied to Jim directly before seeing his response on the digest). First, thanks to Jim for keeping us updated on his progress in hacking the 96 chip. Although a long-time and satisfied Dinan customer, I'm still ready to try an alternate chip source. Just send me a application form Jim! Jim wrote in response (>> are mine, > are Jim's):
>>Rumor has it that various tuners are considering retrofitting the 95
> First the runners ... the manifolds are a bit different, attachment wise, In my previous post, I neglected to mention that Mike at Dinan's had cautioned me that serious engineering would be required to retrofit the 95 intake runners and still maintain legal emissions. As the enthusiast, much like anyone buying a lotto ticket for a multi-mil payoff, i sorta blanked out on the caveats after hearing of the potential (see below) of 40 hp!
> Now, onto airboxes and throttlebodies .. you can put the LARGEST throttle
> The BOTTLENECK in the intake side is first and foremost the mousy Heated > The only way to extract maximum gains, is to swap HFM's with a Euro M3
> This has been proven on the DYNO, and doubters are welcome to visit I think Dinan's shop is aware of the importance of the Euro HFM.
>> Mike at Dinan's said that they can imagine 40 extra HP from the engine If the mythical potential of 40 hp drives any tuner shop to continue R&D, i hope folks don't stop trying new approaches to attain that goal.
> NO WAY .. NO HOW .. not street legal .. not passing emissions, not At least in the case of Dinan's shop, they have long been providing 50-state smog-legal chips for both turbos and strokers for some time. Thats why when I heard an employee at Dinan's mention that Steve Dinan even considered the possibility of smog-legal 40 hp gains in the 3.2L engine, it certainly made me pause. Of course, it could take time and $$ to engineer it properly and it might not even be affordable; particularly if it requires opening up the motor
>> with the typical bolt-ons (28 HP is currently gained on the 3L with
> Umm .. let me be the first (not) to state this publicly .. believe ANY Agreed. the proof is in the independent rear-wheel dyno confirmation.
> In talking to BMW race guru, TC Kline ... he told me that the HIGHEST
> That was from a CSL motor that was already significantly ABOVE the 240 The 28 hp gain seen by Dinan in their 95 M3 was also on a slightly better than the average M3. In their advertising brochure, their stock 95 M3 put out 240 hp and 236 lb-ft (not the spec'd 225 lb-ft of the 95). After the bolt-ons, they dyno'ed the rear-wheel hp at 268 and 260 lb-ft. This was with stock cats. I wonder if the 28 hp gain is typical for the 'average' 95 M3. Jim then described a ' an M3 Lux at 273HP using ..'
> 1) Supersprint Headers/Exh. w/ Dr Gas crossover and stock cats
> This is the HIGHEST HP I have EVER seen on an S50USB30 motor that has NOT
> Assume that your new M3 is good for a maybe another 20-25 HP .. AFTER This is the rub. I don't think long-time readers of this list are prone to taking unsubstantiated claims seriously. However, when a reputable shop that has already seen 28 hp gains in a street-driven 95M3 says that they see the potential for more power for a street vehicle with a ~200 cc larger displacement engine, I'm willing to wait and see if they can achieve it. It might take them a lot of time (in which case i'll buy another chip for the interim) and it might be not even be affordable. Even with 25 hp extra, i think an upgraded suspension is a higher priority than buying HP that is on that exponential part of the HP per $ curve. Thats why i bought a 96 M3 instead of doing more mods on my 87 Dinan 2.8L Stroker. At 224 hp and 235 lb-ft of torque, my Stroker is almost at parity with a stock 95 M3 (which is 300 lb heavier than my E30 4DR sedan). But to add any more power to the Stroker, the price per unit HP was just not worth it (port & polish intake/exhaust orifices, street-legal headers etc.) dan 96 M3 Boston Green, Modena Natur, Luxury, H-K
http://dsrna.agi.org/bmw_96M3.html
E30 M3 alloy lower control arms w/ offset bushings & other mods
58K miles, now for sale, see Daniel Chin writes:
>Along the lines of performance upgrades for the 3.2L M3, i've been talking This was also done to meet both emissions requirements and OBD-II regulations .. the S52USB32 is a special beast...
>This was achieved by using ~30% narrower intake runners. This causes It does this by simple moving the Torque curve "down rpm" [towards lower rpms] .. since HP=T*rpm/5252, this reduces peak HP ...
>Rumor has it that various tuners are considering retrofitting the 95 First the runners ... the manifolds are a bit different, attachment wise, and it will not be an easy job to retrofit them .. and keep all the needed emissions hoses working .. which would fault the OBD-II system Now, onto airboxes and throttlebodies .. you can put the LARGEST throttle body in the world on an S50USB30 (3.0l US M3) and the most free flowing airbox in the universe .. you will STILL not see a large improvement .. The BOTTLENECK in the intake side is first and foremost the mousy Heated Film airMass sensor (HFM) which like the airbox & TB came from the 325i The only way to extract maximum gains, is to swap HFM's with a Euro M3 This has been proven on the DYNO, and doubters are welcome to visit either TMS in Mass. or ERT in Delaware! >Also, i'm told that the 3.2L engine has a less radical cam than the 3L. Slighty .. for EMISSIONS sake .. >Mike at Dinan's said that they can imagine 40 extra HP from the engine I can IMAGINE being richer than Bill Gates too .. (Hey John B. can you help me out there?!?) NO WAY .. NO HOW .. not street legal .. not passing emissions, not without having MIL lites flickering all the time .. You see, the game has changed .. OBD-II is here .. you change something and you effect the emissions of the motor just a bit .. BINGO.. on comes the MIL (Check Engine lamp)...
>with the typical bolt-ons (28 HP is currently gained on the 3L with Umm .. let me be the first (not) to state this publicly .. believe ANY peformance claims you hear with MANY grains of salt ... even a whole shaker.. why .. read on MacBeth.. In talking to BMW race guru, TC Kline ... he told me that the HIGHEST HP they had EVER seen on a CSL motor, with headers/race exh. (no cats) and all the intake tricks you could muster was .. 268HP .. (hey +28 :) That was from a CSL motor that was already significantly ABOVE the 240 mark when stock (if I recall TC said about 245ish) .. so all that radical "bolt on" stuff gave a total of 23ish HP .. With cat's we've seen more usual gains of 15-20HP .. NOW, go the WHOLE route.. change the HFM (on 95 cars!) and you get a bit MORE HP ... Today we dynoed an M3 Lux at 273HP using ..
This is the HIGHEST HP I have EVER seen on an S50USB30 motor that has NOT been opened up .. I figure I might be able to squeeze 2-3 HP More with the Euro Resonator for track use .. MAYBE .. so let's say +35HP .. on a motor WITHOUT OBD-II monitoring what I do .. for RACE USE ONLY Assume that your new M3 is good for a maybe another 20-25 HP .. AFTER much research and testing ... Jim |
