Unofficialbmw.com

[Henry]

ANY input or ideas would be helpful. I have this problem and am brainstorming the best way to address it.

>1992 318is 220,000 miles

1. Check Engline Light comes on. According to Bentley the fault code that comes up is O2 Sensor.

2. This makes sense as the in place unit has 110,000 miles on it.

3. Bring it into local NYC shop for replacement. They suggest placing vehicle onto their computer. Say it's important as the code could have multiple means. I say plugs are new, mass airflow sensor has about 60k-70k on it, new air filter (will check this again just in case it's bad), new fuel pump, new fuel filter.

So I tell shop to treat this as a MAINTENANCE MATTER and change the part. thank you very much.

4. Call Manhattan BMW and they say..."Hook the vehicle up to our computer. The code has multiple meanings." I do not do this. Change O2 Sensor and then WAIT TO SEE IF DRIVABILITY IMPROVES.

5. Pre-replacement symptom: Following a few days of severe rain and vehicle parked outside (vehicle unfortunately not in Santa Fe at the moment) in street IT EXHIBITS SYMPTOMS OF ROUGH IDLE.

6. Part replaced. Rough idle eliminated. However, CHECK ENGINE light still on and off. No immediate symptoms.

7. Drive vehicle 7 miles. CHECK ENGINE LIGHT ON AND OFF. I rev engine to increase rpms, light goes off...and on again. Then the scary part: I BEGIN TO LOSE POWER...A VERY LITTLE ROUGH THAT GOES AWAY...JUST A LITTLE...SO I REV MOTOR AND MAKE IT TO THE DESTINATION. POWER RETURNS WHEN I REV MOTOR. However, the vehicle is still unpredictable and tends to become sluggish with gas pedal depressed there's a noticeable power loss the comes and then goes away.

I park the car.
Take a trip (visited the bmw werk today in munich)

Call the Santa Fe dealer...whom I do trust and is quite honest...and worth the charges since they get the problem first time out (free plug) when you actually need a complex problem solved.

8. He tells me to hook car up onto a BMW Dealer Computer with Proprietary Software. Says this will pinpoint the issue as dates, repetition of events etc. will be in greater detail than any computer capability of any independent shop.

9. I research dealers in NYC Metro Area and locate one in New Jersey that seems to have excellent customer response.

I refuse to go to BMW Manhattan for even a cup of coffee. Way to Nutty Expensive and the customer reviews suck.

10. Am not inclined to bring vehicle to independent shop because of the proprietary software/diagnosis issue.

SO...HERE I SIT IN MUNICH GERMANY...enjoying my vacation, the WERK is drop dead gorgeous...it is a marketing paradise...children playing with bmws and associated video games etc...all inside a drop dead beautiful piece of splendid building design. Took lots of photos. It's so incredibly attractive that it's impossible to take of bad photograph there.

AND I NEED H-E-L-P.

suggestions about how i'm approaching this
what would you do
look...i could have a faulty fuel pump, i could have a lousy gas filter...even though they're both new. it could be the computer (current computer is 120,000 miles old and the original lasted 100,000 miles, it could be ANYTHING as far as I'm concerned.

However ARE THEIR ANY IDEAS OUT THERE besides what steps I've taken.

PLEASE.

anyway...it's late, i'm jet lagged, visiting Neuschwanstein Castle tomorrow, (remember Fairy Land Castle of Walt Disney), having
fun playing the Tourista and forgetting my bmw probs...

So WHAT WOULD Y-O-U do if this problem appeared?
Or IF YOU'VE GONE THROUGH SOMETHING LIKE THIS what did you do?

[walshja]

hey Henry

My wifes 528iT had the same codes, and I replaced the o2 sensors, and the problem did not go away.

what was happening is I had vacuum leaks which was causing a lean mixture, and was creating a situation where the o2 sensor readings were off charts.

so I will guess your sensors are fine, but you need to investigate if you have any vacuum leaks. I can't remember where the leaks were on my wifes car, the dealer fixed them, but there were several.

don't wait long, like I did, because you can ruin your cat converters in the process.
_________________
joe

1994 325iC, 195k miles
http://home.comcast.net/~walshja/index.html <--- check it out

[PJK]

Hi Henry,

I have been watching this for some time and I still have nothing definite but I do have some thoughts.

One of my first thoughts was an intake air leak as Joe suggested and I wouldn't rule it out. You said that it idles OK now. With false air it is hard to get a good idle. You have done the oxygen sensor. It is not likely to be the fuel pump or filter since you said it runs fine a high speed.

I would look at the air flow meter. I think you have the old vane type. If so you might check to see if it moves freely also there are electrical contacts in a rotary switch attached to the vane. A spray of TV tuner cleaner might help there.

Phil

[Henry]

Thanks fellas... I've been over here in Munich since the 1st and return nyc on Monday. The vehicle is quitely sitting, indoors, in a Jersey City garage. I can't but think that sitting outside in nyc, through the heavy rains, heavy snows and not much mileage...fewer than 50 miles of driving...since the first of the year hasn't helped much.

I'm wondering if there's MOISTURE IN THE GAS LINE. Am going to put either a can of Techtron or BG 44K into the gas tank might help.

Am still a believer of going for the simplest thing first. Keep the vehicle in tip top shape. However, with a rough winter, outside parking, 18 years of mostly reliable service and a healthy 220K I do realize that anything's possible.

I just want to get into the vehicle and drive it back to Santa Fe.

Next November, for the return drive to nyc I'm going to have the inspection and promptly turn around and return her to the garage in the nice, dry climate of the Southwest.


What do you think about trying the additive? ? ?

As for myself...well I rationalize this by realizing it's the first time in 18 yrs that she's really complained and that's not the worst record. I thought Manhattan had it's share of BMW's. Munich and surrounding towns far exceeds the BMW population of NYC and LA combined. I think, given what appears to be the $6.00 per gallon cost of fuel here, that there's not much high mileage driving done and that many people lease their vehicles. Believe the driving habits are 180 degree different than ours. Just don't think, and this is a generalization, most people can afford $100++ fill ups and 15K-20K miles of driving per year. So it makes sense to lease. And the Germans around here mostly drive with a standard transmission...a stick.

Lots ride bicycles. There's very wide bicycle lanes adjacent to each sidewalk throughout the city and surrounding towns.

If you're ever here than be sure to visit the BMW WERK. It's a beautiful building. Really, really gorgeous and worth the U-Bahn ride to see.

h.

[Henry]

sorry posting error

[PJK]

After trying the additive you might look up a well driller and ask to borrow his witching stick and wave it over the hood of your car.

Phil

[Henry]

Anything Phil. Anything that might work. I'll sprinke fairy dust on the vehicle.

[dale]

Henry,
You've probably tried this already, but have you modified the drain for the housing of the engine brain? The DME can flood in a car wash or heavy rains.

http://www.pelicanparts.com/bmw/techarticles/E36-DME-Repair/E36-DME-Repair.htm
_________________
http://www.unofficialbmw.com
UnofficialBMW.com Webmaster
dale@unofficialbmw.com
sold in 2016
87 325 5spd eta

[Henry]

Not yet Dale. Given the VERY heavy rains we had before the fault appeared the thought of a DME gone bad has occurred.

Am back in nyc and am now going over my Bentley. The first thing am going to do is to bring vehicle into dealer so they can read the faults.

Am told their software goes into more detail than what I can pick up using the accelerator pedal and the dot dash signal of the engine light.

I still have my mech/brkdwn insurance and this will be a major help. However, if there's a mistake I believe that I'm on the line for the second try.

In all the years I've owned the car (1 this is the first "mystery." Am taking the long view with this. Sometimes there's just a problem that requires experience and a bit of good fortune to solve.

Can anyone suggest a dealer around the NYC area. Highly doubt that it's going into Manhattan BMW although I will pay them a visit. Even with insurance they are quite a handful to deal with. Prefer a suburban dealership. Car is still drivable.

thanx will keep all posted can't wait to get into car and drive it west

[Henry]

HERE'S WHAT WE HAVE

1. No solution to problem

2. Codes read for Mass Air Flow Sensor and O2 Sensor. O2 just replaced.
Air flow sensor replaced 1/04 at 156K. Car now at 220K+. About 70K on the unit.

3. They have car static and no power loss. Intend to drive vehicle 20/30 minutes on Monday to find out if symptoms can be duplicated.

4. Codes still appear even though asymptomatic.

5. Question about computer...if it's bad than it could be throwing off false codes. However, car does start well and idles well.

6. Cat is original. Asked them to see if it is blocked. Test is to rap a hammer onto it and check for loose material.

Anyway, codes support mass air flow sensor. Although it could be something else. My vehicle is '92 so I have the less sophisticated version of computer/fault codes. Be grateful if you have advanced model as it's easier to locate problem.


ANY ADDITIONAL IDEAS. Dealer is amenable to input.


A Big F*&king Mystery

[PJK]

Hi Henry,

Check back to my first post on this. Mass Air Flow Sensor is another name for air flow meter.

Go check it out as I suggested.

Phil

[Henry]

All indications are ;pointing to the air flow etc.. I jest want to get into my car, leave the insanity of new york city and return to new mexico. And when we roll the dice hope that the air flow meter comes up and the fault codes go down.

I am running out of tranquilizers.
5 1/2 months in nyc can do this.
Come November it gets inspected
and returned to its nice newmexican
home.

[Henry]

Update...Service Rep called with following info.

1. Ran test on mass airflow sensor. Tested ok.
2. Install new ignition wires. Am running original wires.
3. Replace newly installed 02 sensor. Was told this 02 sensor is faulty.
4. If needed replace newly installed fuel filter. They're holding on this.
5. Faulty 02 sensor to be returned to me. Since the shop that installed 02 sensor was recommended by close friend who maintains strong ties with the shop I probably not complain to the shop. Uncharacteristic of me, will think this over. However, friend did me favor and sometimes have to leave things alone and eat it because of friendship.
7. Thank goodness for the unlimited mechanical brkdwn policy. They don't write this one anymore and as long as I keep the comprehensive and as long as the repair is less expensive than the value of the vehicle coverage is maintained. New mech/brkdwn policy limited to 100K. Policy I have is open ended. So incentive is to bring vehicle into shop.

8. Will let you know if the above solves the problem. Hope so.

[walshja]

good luck Henry !!
_________________
joe

1994 325iC, 195k miles
http://home.comcast.net/~walshja/index.html <--- check it out

[Henry]

UPDATE:

OK...I picked up vehicle yesteday.

NOW...

1. Tested the Mass Airflow etc. with meter. Not broken.

2. Installed new set of ignition wires to replace the original 18 yr old 220K set.

3. Replaced the newly installed O2 sensor. It was broken

4. Was told the new plugs "were black." Replaced new plugs. They were blackened due to new faulty 02 sensor.

5. Due to the possibility of multiple causes of problem the dealer took time to analyze symptoms. What appeared obvious was not the cause of problem. To their credit they didn't tear car apart looking for anything and eveything.

6. I believe that I was treated fairly and charged appropriately. I recommend BMW of Bloomfield NJ. Now...this reflects the way they went about dealing with a strange problem. I don't at all believe they were unfair nor greedy. Given the ambiguous issues anything could have been done and than another thing. All of which was billable. None of this happened.

Should leave for the Southwest next week. Hopefully all is ok.

Thank you for your interest and suggestions and support and help. I had some very anxious moments. And during my trip to Munich managed to put all of this aside and enjoy the Werk. You guys are great!