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[TnSlim]

For starters, your subject is misleading. It was not a Pentagon conclusion. And the kommission was about a bipartisan as the ACLU.

One witch hu ...I mean kommission member, Jamie Gorelick, played such an integral role in the intelligence failures leading to 9/11 that her refusal to resign from the kommission and submit herself as a witness to it clearly is a contravention of the kommission’s charter, to wit: “...to prepare a full and complete account of the circumstances surrounding the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, including preparedness for and the immediate response to the attacks.....”

Gorelick refused to heed Louie Freeh’s 1994 warning to “...strengthen investigative powers against suspected 'undesirable aliens,' accelerating deportation appeal proceedings and limiting U.S. participation in a visa waiver pilot program under which 9.5 million foreigners entered the U.S.....” Further, Gorelick’s 1995 memo to AG Reno resulted in additional restrictions being placed on communications between law-enforcement officials and prosecutors pursuing counterterrorism cases.

Gorelick was instrumental in grooming the flawed intelligence landscape that led to 9/11. That she was an investigator rather than a subject of the investigation is a true measure of the hypocrisy of this komission and the irrelevancy of its conclusions.

I was particularly amused that one of the “findings” of these civil servants sitting on taxpayer-expensed leather-upholstered chairs in Washington, D.C. was that they knew better what had happened on the ground in Prague more than three years previous than did the Czech intelligence officials who were there. They ridiculed Billary for her séances with Eleanor and Nancy for consulting astrologers. I can’t understand why Jean Dixon and Uri Geller weren’t appointed to this komission.

A few facts the kommission conveniently overlooked:

Iraq struck an accord with al-Qa’aida in 1993 in which they would teach the terrorists how to make bug bombs, in return for which OBL would leave Saddam alone.

The has CIA documented “...almost 100 separate examples of Iraq-al Qaeda co-operation going back to 1992....”

Slick Willie bombed a Sudanese aspirin factory in 1998 because of intelligence reports that it was a dual-use manufacturing facility that could produce key components of VX nerve gas. Richard Clarke has stated publicly that he personally had certain knowledge that this facility had produced VX. That facility was designed by an Iraqi member of al-Qa’aida. And it was Saddam who gave him the technical know-how to make it all happen.

On October 10, 2002, Democrat Senator Hillary Klinton herself made a speech on the floor of the US Senate in which she said, “...He [Saddam] has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including Al Qa'aida members....”

A senior member of Saddam’s Mukhabarat intelligence service visited OBL in Afghanistan for a weeks-long confab in 1998. Later that same year, Saddam hosted a visit to Baghdad by one of OBL’s aides in order to foster closer ties with al-Qa’aida.

A commander in Uday’s elite paramilitary Fedayeen, a Lt. Col. Ahmed Hikmat Shakir, attended the January 2000 al-Qa’aida "summit" in Kuala Lumpur. The event was the occasion of the planning for the 9/11 attacks. Also in attendance were Khalid al Midhar and Nawaz al Hamzi, the hijackers of AA Flight 77 (which was crashed into the Pentagon) and Tawfiz al Atash, a high-ranking OBL lieutenant and mastermind of the USS Cole bombing.

Saddam’s Fedayeen trained al-Qa’aida in Iraq at purpose-built training facilities at Nahrawan and Salman Pak. The Salman Pak training included ways to hijack airplanes.

Some of OBL’s cohorts left Afghanistan shortly before 9/11 and established a base of operations in Al Biyara, Iraq.

Iraqi nationals were among the captured al-Qa’aida in the war in Afghanistan. High-level al-Qa’aida detainees told that they received training in manufacturing chemical munitions from Iraq.

OBL’s lieutenant, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, mastermind of the 9/11 attacks, captured in Pakistan in 2003, has revealed that he is an Iraqi intelligence agent.

The Saudi National Guard was placed on alert in December of 2000 after learning that Saddam had agreed to ''assist al-Qaida in attacking U.S./UK interests in Saudi Arabia.''

Spanish police investigating their own al-Qa’aida terror attack found documents showing one of their bombing suspects (who also had lent aid to the 9/11 hijackers) was invited to a party by the Iraqi ambassador to Spain under his al-Qa’aida code name.

The London Telegraph -- hardly a Bush shill -- reported the discovery in December, 2003 of a memo from Saddam which gave details a visit by Atta to Baghdad just weeks before the 9/11 attacks.

According to Dr Ayad Allawi, a member of Iraq's ruling seven-man presidential committee, “...We are uncovering evidence all the time of Saddam's involvement with al-Qaida....” “...Not only did Saddam have contacts with al-Qa’aida, he had contact with those responsible for the September 11 attacks...."

Although Bush 43 has never claimed Saddam was responsible for 9/11, a federal judge saw enough of a connection to award $104 million to the plaintiffs in a wrongful death suit against the Taliban, the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, al-Qa’aida, bin Laden, Hussein and the Republic of Iraq.

Interjecting whatever atrocities you allege the US and/or US officials might have committed is a red herring, nothing more than attempt to obfuscate these three facts:
1) This kommission couldn’t find its collective *ss with both hands, a copy of Gray’s Anatomy and a convex mirror.
2) Saddam supported al-Qa’aida, the PLO and Hamas.
3) He still would be absent the leadership of Bush 43.

[ 06-19-2004: Message edited by: Tennessee Slim ]

[panzerkeil302]

Well, if we want to debate the 9/11 commission, why not the warren commission? Would it make you happier if I just said “government commission on 9/11”?

Lets say Osama and Saddam were best friends. Lets say Saddam was planning more attacks without Osammie. Lets say, every person on the planet agrees that Sandman was going to do something to the US…just for kicks. Lets say we all agree he had to go…and he’s gone. Are we safer? Was he the biggest threat? Are there Al Queda in Iraq? Answers 1) no one can say 2) no 3) yes.

So what have we done to make the US safer? We’ve spend 1 billion dollars a day on a sect that just packed it’s bags and moved to Spain, Iran, Pakistan and Saudi…..we’re spending a fortune to give a people who hate us power, and we’re just as likely to see another attack….

You can’t win the hearts and minds of these people…for the money and loss of life we’ve paid/suffered, wouldn’t it have been better spent on homeland security, the yf-22 and Special Forces? Was putting American lives at risk every day on the ground the best way to do this? Is killing every Muslim the answer to stopping terrorism?

[ 06-19-2004: Message edited by: panzerkeil302 ]

[TnSlim]

None of which changes the facts that the kommission was wrong, Saddam had long-standing ties to al-Qa’aida, and the principal reason he isn’t still supporting international terrorists is George W. Bush.

[panzerkeil302]

...let me just ask you directly. Do you think Iraq posed the most danger to the US?

[patrick66]

Even when confronted with the facts (i.e the truth), your standard reply, panzerboy, is "but, but, but". Like I said before, you and your type will never get it. And, when our nation and our allies eventually emerge victorious, despite your desire for the contrary, you'll still bitch about the outcome and how victory on our side was achieved. Your best course of action is to just sit back, shut the hell up, and watch the pros in action!

Notice the loud outcry from Muslims worldwide decrying the barbarism employed in the Middle East, the Phillipines, Malaysia, Pakistan, and more by their "freedom-loving" brethren...Wait, there is none!!! Ah, the deafening silence from them speaks volumes!

BTW, there is a difference between honest disagreement and debate over the issues, and obstruction and outright sedition. Kennedy, Kerry, Moore, the 9/11 commission and the like choose the latter. WE ARE AT WAR!!! Victory for our side is the ONLY outcome where our nation can survive and thrive. If the other side wins, discussions like this will never happen again, and you will face Mecca 5x/day, whether you want to or not. Deal with that! Out!

[ 06-20-2004: Message edited by: patrick66 ]

[panzerkeil302]

I don't think you get it, pat66.

You can not kill every Muslim. As much as you think it is right, as much as you want to. It is just flat out wrong. It is wrong as an American, it is wrong Christian.

What would you say of Gen. Zinni? Widely respected, but at odds with Bush admin. over how they are handling middle east.

Do you think he is worshiping mecca?

It is the most American thing you can do, Pat66, to question our leaders...Blind lemmings did not create this country, great visionaries who questioned a bogus authority did.

To save our boys lives...this is why we fight;

[TnSlim]

More misrepresentation, misdirection and psychobabble.

[panzerkeil302]

"More misrepresentation, misdirection and psychobabble."

What have I misrepresented? That a government commission has found no Osama/Saddam link?

Where am I misdirecting? That every muslim does not hate the US?

And is it psychobabble to want a stronger United States?

[TnSlim]

Okay, kiddies, for those of you who’ve been sleeping, lets recap:

The subject of this thread is incorrect. It was not the Pentagon who drew these (erroneous) conclusions.

The findings of the subject “committee” are incorrect. Through either incompetence or malfeasance, they chose to ignore a preponderance of independently verifiable intelligence proving that Saddam Hussein had longstanding ties to al-Qa’aida (and its Ansar al-Islam and Ansar Al Sunna subsidiaries), as well as the growing body of evidence that he also had close ties with the 9/11 terrorists.

Mr. Hussein is no longer in business, thanks to …guess who?

We now resume our normal broadcast.

[panzerkeil302]

Sorry slim, try again...I don't make the news, I just report it.

"based on interviews with government intelligence and law-enforcement officials. The report said "no credible evidence"

now if you want to talk about misleading, how about this header;
"UN Admits Saddam Had WMDs"

geesh, talk about spinning...

[panzerkeil302]

whoops, forgot to mention

"Pentagon finds 'no credible evidence' of link between al-Qaida and Iraq"

This came from the text header of the internet link to the Seattle times.

You could write a letter to the editor about the header.

[TnSlim]

Well slap me and call me Susie. One of the komission members finally got a clue.

Live and in front of God and everybody, yesterday on NBC's "Meet the Press”, Commissioner John F. Lehman said “...[documents captured in Iraq] indicate that there is at least one officer of Saddam's Fedayeen, a lieutenant colonel, who was a very prominent member of al-Qa’aida...."

He was referring to Lt. Col. Ahmed Hikmat Shakir, who I earlier noted as having attended the 9/11 planning session in Kuala Lumpur.

Sorry panzer, try again...I don't make the truth, I just report it.

[panzerkeil302]

So you are reporting that you saw something on TV that contradicts the CIA's and FBI's testimony?

Sorry slim, that ain't reporting news, that's called wishful thinking. But if you can find a link, I'd love to read it.