Unofficialbmw.com Forum Index Unofficialbmw.com
The UnofficialBMW BB, answers for your BMW questions.
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

building a Pro3 racecar

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Unofficialbmw.com Forum Index -> Racing

Support Unofficialbmw.com :: Download Free Healthy Habits iPhone app!

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
dale



Joined: 22 Aug 1999
Posts: 3083
Location: Seattle, WA USA

PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2004 3:01 pm    Post subject: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

What's it take to build a Pro3 race car?

At a minimum, the safety gear, and stripping out all interior except dash and door panels, and the right tires.

Minimum:
8 point roll cage, prefer welded over boltin
Autopower sells a boltin, or a weld-in kit
http://www.ioportracing.com/faq/APapplications.htm
On the East Coast, talk to James at http://www.bimmerworld.com.
In the Northwest, talk to Russ at RaceTechFAb in Portland http://www.racetechfab.com/

You can buy most of the following parts from Andy at Armadillo Racing http://www.armadilloracing.com/ And your safety gear as well. Tell him Dale@unofficialbmw.com sent you. He also has a complete line of safety gear.
- window net
- racing bucket seat
- 5 point or 6 point racing harness
- fire suppression system

- set of 225/45/15(or 225/50/15) Toyo RA1 or RR tires shaved to 4/32s(or less)
- AIM Tire has good prices and does a good job on shaving tires: http://www.aimtire.com/typ_category.asp?Unique=38252.910150463&ObjectID=6369
- Also Vilven in IL is a good source.

- remove all sound insulation from the flooring. get dry ice, apply, then whack with a mallet. comes right up.

- get weight down to 2650 pounds, including driver, at the _end_ of the race, not the start.

Optional Go-Fast stuff:

SUSPENSION:

- 15x7 Team Dynamics wheels from Bimmerworld.com

- coilover suspension with adjustable Bilstein or Koni shocks, no external reservoir
Ground Control: http://www.ground-control.com/?D=f606e201fc9910d89ac64e162db6d324

Ireland Engineering:
http://www.bmw2002.com/

- also get camber plates for the front top strut mount, rear camber/toe adjustment not as important, I prefer Ground Control plates

- sway bars, I like the Suspension Techniques, but the tubular ones from Ireland
are cool also, and more adjustable.

ENGINE:

- header, either Ireland's or the Stahl header, free flow exhaust
http://www.kormanfastbmw.com/e30.htm

- chip, I recommend Mark D'Sylva, tell him Dale at Unofficialbmw.com sent you

http://www.dsylva-tech.ca/

--> Don't buy a crap chip off of ebay!

- remove all A/C components! All that extra weight is slowing you down!

- remove power steering belt, pump, and hoses. block off the holes in the
power steering rack with bolts after removing
power steering fluid

- remove engine fan, when you're moving, you don't need a fan, if you're stopped, shut it off! (doesn't apply to street cars)

DRIVETRAIN:

- 4.10LSD diff, stock on E30 M3, and some 325i with an authmatic, I'd try to find it on ebay, then get rebuilt by local shop.
NW Differentials in Kirkland WA for those in the NW.

http://motors.listings.ebay.com/Transmission- Drivetrain_Differentials-Parts_W0QQfromZR11QQsacategoryZ33731QQsocmdZListingItemList

- front strut brace, I like the Sparco or Ireland 1piece bar. Be careful to measure your shock tower distance before ordering. There are 2 sizes.

- general, new control arms, only stock steel, no aluminum!! new tie-rods

- short shifter, more fun to shift fast, I like the factory Z3 1.9 shift lever and
the rest of the components just new factory stuff. 30% reduction in shift throw
length with this shift lever

BRAKES:

- stock, but NO ABS, it is now illegal for 2008 in Pro3

- brake pads, lots of guys are running the Porterfield R4 pad, lots of choices
Or XP8/XP9/XP10s from CarboTech http://www.carbotecheng.com

- brake rotors, generic OEM Brembo rotors. cryo treat them if you like, but they last just fine without it. I get an entire season on 1 set of rotors.

- run 3" cooling ducts to the front brakes, the rears don't need any more cooling then stock.

For tons of pics of my car, see these pages: http://www.unofficialbmw.com/racing/images/
http://www.unofficialbmw.com/racing/paint/

Rules: See the PDF here, search for '1316' and you'll find the complete exact list of rules.
http://www.icscc.com/rules/Cr2004.pdf

http://www.icscc.com/rules/Cr2005.pdf

http://www.icscc.com/rules/Cr2006.pdf

http://www.icscc.com/rules/Cr2007.pdf

Dale


Last edited by dale on Thu Mar 20, 2014 10:53 am; edited 6 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JRS



Joined: 09 Jun 2002
Posts: 2386
Location: USA

PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 5:33 am    Post subject: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

Dale,

Are the Porterfield R4 brake pads "low dust" ? In addition, what's your input on Crossdrilled rotors (brembo or what-have-you) ?

JRS
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
McK



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 1126
Location: Chicago

PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 6:15 am    Post subject: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

quote:
Originally posted by dale:

remove all sound insulation from the flooring. get dry ice, apply, then whack with a mallet. comes right up.



Interesting idea. Dale, is this for the neoprene-type coating on the bottom of the car, or is this sound proofing inside of the car? Did you remove all that cr*p on the bottom of the car too?

Do you have a link with different classes for the cars? Could E36 fall under Pro3? Also, would you care to explain the process of getting a lisence/certified etc?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
dale



Joined: 22 Aug 1999
Posts: 3083
Location: Seattle, WA USA

PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 10:03 pm    Post subject: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

JRS: no, the Porterfield R4 pads are dirty, but they stop very well at race speeds. I have been using Carbotech XP8s as they seem to last twice as long are just seem
to be better pads, for about the same cost, aprox $120/front $150/rear

McK: the soundproofing inside of the car. I don't bother with the stuff underneath
as we have a minimum weight limit of 2650 pounds, I already have to add 50
pounds of ballast.
Pro3 right now is only for E30s with the M20B25 motor, and non-M3 stuff that
came on North American E30s. Rear spoilers, front spoilers, different options like that.
The e36 325i will probably never be allowed in Pro3 as it has too much HP and the
suspension is a better design, it would trounce the E30.
The point of Pro3 is to provide a way to build a fun _affordable_ 3series BMW.
The E36 costs in the range of $20k to build up, the E30 only costs around $10k to build up.

Dale
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Steve D



Joined: 09 Aug 2004
Posts: 102
Location: San Diego

PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2004 4:55 pm    Post subject: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

Dale - thanks for the great information! One questions - what type of 'cold air intake' do you recommend? I've read several posts on the board regarding intake swaps, the majority of which are negative a the products under discussion simply place a cone filter in the engine compartment to suck in the hot air. I haven't seen any intakes for E30's that would actually take in cold air (ie not air from inside the engine compartment). I've been considering trying to manufacture a homemade intake, but haven't come up with much on the idea front. Could you point me in the right direction? Thanks again!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
dale



Joined: 22 Aug 1999
Posts: 3083
Location: Seattle, WA USA

PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2004 6:00 pm    Post subject: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

Murph,
Mine is basically a homemade system. There is a flange adapter from the AFM to a 3" diameter 2" long pipe that the big cone clamps onto.
Then a sheet of tin/aluminum to block off the hot air from the rest of the engine.
Also, I have no fan on my race car, so no fan wash to worry about. But I'm sure the air at speed has a similar effect as fan wash would.

Dale
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Steve D



Joined: 09 Aug 2004
Posts: 102
Location: San Diego

PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 2:29 pm    Post subject: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

Dale - I just ordered the XP10's for front & 8's for rear, after burning thru 2 sets of Cool Willy's in 5 weekends of HPDE driving. Hopefully I'll get a bit better wear out of these! 4 of those weekends was before I got the cooling ducts hooked up, though.

Have you tried the 10's? The guy at Carbotech warned me that the "holy sh!t" factor would be much higher with the 10's vs. the 8's (meaning that they bite much harder / stop much faster). Anyway, I thought I'd give 'em a try.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Tom Olsson
Site Admin


Joined: 03 Nov 2004
Posts: 242
Location: Seattle, WA, US

PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 3:51 pm    Post subject: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

You may not want to go to a really "torquey" brake pad. (as in a whole ton of initial bite) I've found that it's entirely too easy to lock up a wheel with just Porterfield R4's. I imagine if I went to something like a PF97, I'd be in all sorts of trouble, lighting up the ABS all the time. As it is right now, I have to remind myself to be *smooth* onto that brake pedal in the braking zones. The car's got more brake than tire, at least in it's current set-up.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Steve D



Joined: 09 Aug 2004
Posts: 102
Location: San Diego

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:40 pm    Post subject: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

Finally got the car to the track with the Carbotechs. They weren't kidding - the 10's/8's combo definitely has plenty of "bite". Thank God for ABS! This was my last event on Azenis tires, just ordered RA-1's. I suppose the ABS may be less active with stickier tires?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Tom Olsson
Site Admin


Joined: 03 Nov 2004
Posts: 242
Location: Seattle, WA, US

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2005 2:15 pm    Post subject: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

It should get better, yes. Track pads can overwhelm street tires pretty easily. You will still be able to get into the ABS if you're not smooth, so practice *easing* onto the brake pedal. You can still push hard, but you need to be smooth getting onto the binders. Be prepared for bruised shoulders.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
gmiller



Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 27
Location: Kirkland, WA

PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:21 pm    Post subject: Re: building a Pro3 racecar Reply with quote

Steve D wrote:
Dale - thanks for the great information! One questions - what type of 'cold air intake' do you recommend?

The more we try to improve on the original design the more we learn. When the cone CAI, the stock air cleaner housing with a K&N, and the stock housing with K&N and internal horn removed were all compared on a Dyno, the stock system with a K&N and the horn intact won!
Just clean up the area behind the head light where teh air enters and maybe enlarge the grill opening around the headlight, keep a clean K&N filter and DRIVE!
_________________
'97 M3/4dr - 325i Pro3 #120 - 74 Alfa Spider,MFI,160HP,Fast & Fun, Red of course - Asst USVs = Ugly Support Vehicles
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Unofficialbmw.com Forum Index -> Racing All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group